The newest version of the Brattleboro Selectboard had their first regular meeting, and it was quite something. Chair Liz McLoughlin kept things under control but things weren’t going her way most of the evening. The public was riled, the new members had “ideas,” and her suggestions weren’t always easily agreed upon by others. It was a long meeting.
The primary focus of the night was what to do about the rejected FY26 budget and how to go about doing it. It’s not 100% determined, but generally there will be lots of meetings in April (most Tuesdays and Thursdays), including a listing session to hear why the budget was rejected, a meeting to discuss what was heard at the listening session, and more meetings to discuss whatever then needs to be discussed. There will also be one or two special Representative Town Meetings to vote on whatever gets presented.
And, our new Fire Chief was sworn-in. There was much rejoicing.
Preliminaries
(FYI to Town, we were let into Zoom without a password.)
…
It’s the first regular meeting of the new selectboard:
Liz McLoughlin – Chair
Oscar Heller – VC
Isaac Evans-Frantz – Clerk
Peter Case
Amanda Ellis-Thurber
and we’ll be swearing in a new Fire Chief – Jay Symonds.
You will be stunned and amazed to learn that they start late. Quite late. 6:22
…..
Chair Elizabeth McLaughlin – we met in executive session. No action was taken. Now, the next item is a ceremonial item, the swearing on of Jay Symonds our new Fire Chief.
Town Clerk does the swearing in. He’s officially the Fire Chief. (Applause) Wife pins the badge on him.
Liz – We’ll take a five minute break to congratulate Jay then return to our business.
(“welcome, welcome, thanks thanks…”)
(“testing testing testing”)
All the FD turns out and shakes his hand. Town Staff, too.
Peter – the mics are always on… : )
….
Liz – OK, so. We have a fire chief. Chair’s remarks. (gavel) We will resume. Last Wednesday there was a 3 alarm fire at SIT, an electrical fire in 5 buildings. 126 people displaced. 17 minors. No injuries, but it was a large emergency and I wanted to say the FD and DPW responded immediately, the town sprang into action. Pete Lynch helped. Asst Fire Chief. Carol Locate, Dan Tyler, DPW, Seth Thomas, and Jeremy Evans, BUHS, the state, sheriff, red cross and SIT. Coop and Vt Country Deli helped. I was in emergency planning meetings and witnessed fine performance of our staff. Calm caring and thorough. All needs were addressed. We are very fortunate to have such capable professional staff with a deep bench of resources. Especially Pete Lynch. I thank all staff.
Town Manager John Potter – I also want to thank all the town staff and community members for coming together. I’ll bring some recommendations for next meeting for accommodations. Charter Revision Commission has a survey about town meeting choices at the town’s website, or at the library or Senior Center. Starting this meeting, the zoom credentials will be updated every quarter, listed on the agenda and town calendar.
Amanda Ellis-Thurber – I have a cold, but am wearing a mask.
Isaac Evans-Frantz – I visited the Econo-Lodge today as hundreds of Vermonters were exited from the program. I spoke with a gentleman using cane. he had nowhere to go, didn’t know where to sleep tonight. I talked to a man who had a wheelchair, who waited for hours to renew a voucher. People are falling through the cracks just up the road. I commend those who have shown kindness and care and concern despite the challenges. I want to thank those working for solutions – the community homelessness task force. They have a proposal and there are state resources available. There needs to be a location. The Baptist Church used to do it. The time for planning – we want to look at it early on about where people can go. We want options that dont raise taxes or deplete funds. It broke my heart today. I’m grateful for the work people are doing. Drop off camping gear at Groundworks. The board will work on solutions…
Public
Liz – the budget is on the agenda, so talk about it later.
Marta – in light of what Isaac said, would the town remove the obstacles on benches – it sends the wrong message. I was to request the town does it out of kindness.
Cristina – hi new selectboard. I just want to bring to your attention that there is funding for extreme weather shelter that municipalities are encouraged to apply for. Deadline is April 25, but the committee mentioned has been working on this. It was too late for last winter, so I hope the work we put in could not be wasted and we could put in an application before April 25. Not sure if town emergency plan includes extreme weather shelters. Working with town and other residents I was surprised at Brattleboro that we are not emergency prepared without Red Cross. We have no options. Nowhere for anyone to go if they might freeze to death at night. Not just for our homeless, but if someone’s furnace breaks in the night. Brattleboro should be prepared to out up people in an emergency situation.
Scott C – on Main Street. I want to ask, in November the electrical hookups for electric and hybrid vehicles in the municipal parking center were removed, and haven’t reappeared. Permanently gone? We want to be green in the Green Mountain State and not use fossil fuels – could you reinstall them in the parking garage. We are to have new parking passes this quarter, but couldn’t use it. I’m not renewing this quarter because the chargers aren’t present.
Kenneth – recent resident. It is paradise here. Came in August, but there is trouble in paradise. In talking to neighbors. We have a major issue with public safety. The finance committee came up with a booklet to RTM and suggested hiring 4 new police officers, but they don’t have the power to arrest or enforce anything. That should be addressed. Another issue – taxes – we can’t afford over 12.1%. The tax rate has to come down not go up. We need to have a good look…
Liz – you are tailing about the budget… so you should hold them…
Kenneth – and then homelessness and drug addiction. IT’s 19% poverty rate in town, so we have issues with people who can’t afford housing. Good points tonight. And, DPW has done a great job with snow removal. Some need repaving… pleased t be a resident of Brattleboro.
– can we have recess to bring more chairs in the room…
Liz – you can sit in the back room. Plant of room where people are standing.
Bonnie – I have a question. Why can’t we unlock a door to a facility. It will be 22 degrees tonight. With all the power and empty spaces. There must be a door that can be unlocked to let people in.
Matt – I own a local business. I run a business. I’m so outraged. We talk about opening buildings… we have a safety crisis. A state of emergency. I have been personally threatened multiple times. People with mental issues don’t get prosecuted. I was in The Works. The Assistant Manager was cursed at. The person threatened our lives. We’re talking for opening a building? Defunding the police outages me. Here’ the big issue. If it isn’t resolved, there will be no businesses. people will go to Keene. People will take things into their own hand and I have constitutional right to defend ourselves. When they are attacking us – threatened with a knife. The police do the best they can. I don’t blame the police or town. It needs to be done. Enough with opening buildings and helping people. Or people will take things into their own hands.
– I’d like to agree with the first speaker – no hostile architecture. Remove the partitions from the benches. They are only bolted in a nd can be easily removed. No need to replace the bench. Easy to do.
Daniel – I’ve dealt with mental health for 40 years. You all sit here fell good. The retreat can take all they can. people shit in my building, there are needles, tents, fornicating out back. I don’t know if you have the blinders on. I own a business with rental properties. Corporations don’t care. They have a property manager. You are driving me, locals, out. We house homeless people through programs. They destroy the apartments. One out of 8 is good. People are going to lose it. I almost bounced a guys head off the floor. The sack out, all cracked out. They gotta go and follow the process. Do you want them in your home, on your porch?
Liz – OK that’s enough… don’t engage with the community, talk to me.
Daniel – I want to put
– he just defended himself, I guess that;s not allowed either.
Daniel – ma’am, before I lose my cool, I’d like to discuss this on the next agenda and not brushed off. We need to do something so people feel safe in Brattleboro.
Liz – in the budget discussions we will discuss the police budget and community dsafety action plan..
Daniel – you can talk but something needs to happen tomorrow. I will invite you selectboard down there when there is a pile of crap down there. You can come down and clean it.
Liz – okay that’ enough
– come with us for a week
Liz – that’s enough – (gavel)
Allyssa – this last storm my friend totaled her car and we went there and a nice couple was there. She took a long time, she was older, and we asked if she needed to be check on, but she met someone, so then we chatted and it was jovial. She used to regale the stage and are enjoying the meal and love going out. Come to Brattleboro I said – we have Echo, Plate, Kips, and her husband said “are we going to be safe” – so I had to defend Brattleboro. I find myself defending Brattleboro. There was a time when I didn’t do that. We are ragged all over social media. No one is talking well about this town. I had to convince someone to come spend money. I said we had new officers, but they were still leery.
Fric – I would like to say that empathy without accountability is misplaced. I’d like to urge the board and work with police and prosecutors to get meaningful results. Someone at Amy’s creating a problem was not arrested. The employee was charged, which was remarkable, to say the least. People attempting to break in, caught on camera… not arrested for a clear attempt to break in. They’ve done it in the past. If you don’t want to hear it…
Liz – wrap it up… we are having a series od meetings about the budget..
Fric – this isn’t about spending ,only – it is choices about prosecutors make decisions, police, etc.
Liz – thank you.
Sue – I wasn’t going to speak now but I had someone walked up on my porch at night and stole a package off my porch. Two feet away from me. I sent video to the police. He got charged. I got to talk to him to explain the impact to me. If we have a chance to have a say in the judiciary and police, we should take the opportunity. This person then stole something else from WWTrust. I turned in another video. Repeat offenders. Misdemeanors. I intend to follow through with it.
Steve – social services – I talked to someone in Chesterfield. Two heroin addict nephews – one got treatment and did well; another came to Brattleboro and has been in hotel programs since then.
Heddy – A new RTM and I have conversations with my neighbors – some of us are afraid to spend any time downtown anymore. I advocate for our town. I have to work hard to attract professionals to town now. It’s getting increasingly difficult overall.
Ken – I’m confused. two years ago and independent organization named Brattleboro the strongest town in America and yet everyone was afraid. Maybe they were bought off. Maybe money could help those who need help.
Amanda – Thanks for sharing your thoughts. We do have a great town. This is an important thing, and we are compassionate and we do have vibrant businesses. Don’t stop telling people to come , to move to town. We’ll all work to make it better.
Consent Agenda
A. Indivisible Brattleboro Parade Permit Request
B. Windham Regional Commission Appointments
so consented 5-0
Snow Republic – Approve Outside Consumption Permit
Potter – we’ve had an application for an outside permit for Snow Republic
Mr. Bansley – I was approached by the DBA about having something on Elliot Street. For Gallery Walk nights. I’m asking to approve those dates and a specific zone on Elliot Street until the exit of the parking lot – roped off to sell alcohol and food. That’s the gist.
Liz – DBA is working to alleviate neighborhood concerns
Bansley – yes?
Liz – the fan on the roof…
Bansley – no, this is a permit for outdoor consumption
* – what hours…
Bansley – It’s whatever is in the application.
Issac – neighborhood concerns -?
Liz – the DBA is working with them
Bansley – that’s for the hood exhaust, not the permit
approved – 5-0
Selectboard Housekeeping
(i) Rotation Schedule for Reviewing and Signing Warrants
(ii) Annual Selectboard Assignments – Boards and Committees
(iii) Selectboard Rules of Conduct
Liz – this is the much talked about and heralded new selectboard and there are things we must do. The schedule for signing warrants. I suggest we have a sign up sheet and may I suggest that new members sign up first, and the old hands sign up later in the year. April – June is Oscar; June – Aug is Isaac – Aug – Oct is Peter; Oct to Jan – Amanda; then Liz for the rest. That’s time 1.
Liz – annual selectboard assignments for boards and committees – all arena board of civil authority and board of abatement – you are election officials and hear tax appeals. It is rewarding and interesting to be a part of these meetings. Next is Capital Grant Review Board, seldom needed – (Isaac)(Oscar); next is Hazard Mitigation Committee (Liz); Rental Housing Improvement Committee (Isaac); Small Biz Assistance Loan Program (Amanda); Traffic Safety Committee (Oscar), very rewarding; ONE Brattleboro (Oscar), cornerstone of the public safety plan; Community Homelessness Strategy Team (Pete); DV Communications Board (Amanda)(Liz is alternate); Windham Solid Waste Board of Supervisors (Amanda is alternate)) is Stephen Dotson. WRC is Sue and Ralph.
Amanda – are these all public meetings? (no)
Liz – applicants might be members of the public, but they aren’t always public forums like this board.
Amanda – the community homeless team – can the committee apply for the grant that was mentioned earlier?
John Potter -we can take it up there.
Liz – next up are Rules of Engagement… no.. Rules of Procedure. Would the board like to make any changes – there is a version with red line comments with recommended changes.
Potter – the board las year revamped it. There were three things we missed – one was a typo – then there was a change to say the board does not meet at July 4th, and finally, when you convene as Selectbaodr you also convene as the other boards, so you don’t have to go in and out of other modes.
Oscar – page 33, if we disagree at an agenda setting, it goes to a vote of the committee, is it automatically on the agenda?
Liz – (reads it) it is brought tot he selectboard for a vote at the next selectboard meeting, then majority rule.
oscar – how would you like us to ask to be recognized?
Liz – raise hand, say something, whatever…
Oscar – some clarity about responding to public participation…. we should keep to basic admin responses.
Liz – fine with me.
Public
Franz Reichsman – this is inside baseball, but if the chair and vice chair do agree, the board can vote to place it on the agenda. How does that matter come to the board if they don’t put it on the agenda. It could come up in comments. Nothing is written about it…
Liz – Item 3b says if we reject something, we have to tell the other board members prior to the select board meeting
Franz -right, so how does it come to the board?
Liz – a member would raise that issue at the next meeting and perhaps voted on.
Franz – it could be more clear.
Isaac – we should be crystal clear when voting, so next meeting we vote on this?
Liz – ok.
Oscar – what Franz os getting at is procedural – we do it during selectboard comments. I don’t need that wording.
Potter – I’d like to check with Bob – maybe we add an agenda approval item to the agenda.
Liz – we’ll hold it.
Isaac – it is in there under 4, it would just add “at the next meeting”… we just want to be really clear.
Liz – it says consideration, you say vote.
Isaac – it says vote, and Oscar said it would be at the next meeting…. 4a.. not clear when the decision would be made.
Liz – okay, move along?
Dick Degray – Good evening – I know you are back madame Chair – I had my hand up when you were liquor commissioners and had a concern about the outside consumption permit, so pay closer attention. When chair and vice chair have a disagreement, when it comes to the vote of a board, there is no discussion, just an up or down vote, but I don’t see it there. And then, a bot more clarity in your organizational meeting under public participation – no one responded during public participation – most comments were statements but there was a question about the charging stations – so clarify that anyone talking in public participation won’t be responded to? It takes 2?
Liz – Seth tells me if there is a call. If a comment requires staff research I won’t put anyone on the spot. They can come back.
Isaac – if someone has a question that can be answered?
Liz – John will answer it. It’s the Chair’s discretion. There are many lovely items in procedures about public participation, decorum, rules for meetings… I will be enforcing those rules.
Amanda – the zoom situation is different. Seth now runs it. I couldn’t see hands either.
Seth – I didn’t see it right away. There may have been a delay.
Amanda – in past meetings we could see the screen. Dick, it was an accident!
Bob Oeser – Can you see or hear me? Two brief comments – I notice that the wifi setup, I did get a comment in a chat, and I don;t know that I saw a chat before. Then I sent an answer on it.
Liz – we will not use the chat.
Bob – it is working now.
Liz – we will uncork it.
Bob – number 2 – public participation – if someone asks a question and the answer is thank you very much, that answer may not settle ones mind, it may stir up more issues. It is a fine line. You can’t respond substantively, but you could tell someone to contact X department in the morning.. so you aren’t unintentionally dismissive.
Liz – I’ll think of better responses when people ask a question.
Peter – we do a good job of answering questions.
Isaac – as someone on that side, I din’t study the rules. When I heard “thank you very much” I thought it wasn’t taken seriously. So give some context so people don’t know about the rule.
Liz – it is the difference between warned and unwarned items.
FY26 Budget Re-Development
Peter – did we need to…
Liz – I thought we decided to witi to vote on this until Bob…
Peter .
Liz – FY26 Budget Re-Development. First of all, John will introduce this topic and then we will decide on a couple of things about schedule then hear some comments.
John Potter – everyone knows where we are at. No approval for budget at RTM. If we want continuance of Town Government, we need it approved by RTM before July 1. If we can’t do that, things get more expensive for the town. We have a tight deadline with tight staff resources to create a new budget. There are a bunch of questions in your backup materials that I just tossed out there to just frame how to do this daunting effort. Do you have a target date -(ASAP!) – do you want to start reconsideration from FY26 base budget, previously approved budget, or another approach – what number do you want to hit – want to consider other cuts that were rejected, or other services you had in mind to examine – are there some services you don’t want to examine for reductions – do you need other info or analysis – what process do you want to use to shape the new budget. maybe look at a calendar. Start with the RTM meeting date and work backward?
Liz – let’s start with calendar.
Amanda – late May or early June. Not Memorial Day weekend, though. May 17, 31, or June 7th.
Potter – we usually do Saturdays but it could be any other day, or an evening. The warning must be done 30-40 days ahead of the meeting
Amanda- we should ask the public
Liz – May 18 is too soon, so the 31st or the 7th
Oscar – sometime in May
Isaac – May sounds good.
Liz – I have a problem with the 31st. Say the last week in May? When would we notice that?
Potter – we’d warn it the week of the 27th of April.
Liz – Today is the 1st of April. How many meetings do we need to have to do this? Have a meeting to discuss the finance committee report and structural budget items – the reserve, etc. at one meeting. Then another meeting about garbage, and another about Police, and another for other town services, then savings and revenue suggestions.
Oscar – we can warn the meeting before we are done. We are it no matter what, and if we need to have more meetings ourselves we can do that. As for structure and handling topics – I’m not sure. It’s tricky. We need a lively discussion what we each think and what we might consider. So, unless we feel trash decision will change, we may not want a meeting on that.
Liz – the public didn’t fully understand and appreciate what went into that decision and we owe the public that discussion.
Oscar – one other related idea – we need to do this as a group on camera and we all have a lot to say. It would be worth considering a small group of meetings for public input. If we had a good forum, then could we spend our official meetings working on building this?
Liz – we have an established meeting procedure – the selectboard meeting – that’s what we are here for. To review the budget. We’ll discuss it and we’ll hear their comments. best to do it by subject to corral people’s comments. We have a sense of the incendiary issues. You want special meetings – every Tuesday and every Thursday in April? But going outside this format would be unproductive.
oscar – that’s fair but it is anode that could have some merit.
Isaac – we want a budget that will pass RTM. There are benefits to doing it sooner than later. Balance expediency. People will know the situation, but maybe we can look at a pro forma budget for fy2027, and look at the finance committee feedback. Then maybe a one time evening forum.
Liz – we have a room full of people here to talk about the budget. Lets go with that.
Peter =- so each of our meetings is an open forum. We do have to move quickly
Liz – I say go by topic and no freeforall.
Peter – getting a better sense why it didn’t pass would help.
Liz – the finance committee report would be a great place to start, then key topic – garbage, police and other.
Amanda – I back oscar on this – a forum type of event to kick off the budget palanning could be helpful – an hour and a half – to create an open dialogue.
Liz – we could have a special meeting this Thursday. A selectboard Budget Listening Session, and y’all can come back and tell us again.
Amanda – Tell your friends…
Oscar – this doesn’t need to hap[en in two days. It could happen in the first two weeks.
Liz – so tonight is the first. We have a special meeting on the 8th for the listening session, then a meeting on the 15th, and on the 22nd, and on the 29th. That’s four meetings. Do you think we need more? Why don’t we put the listening schedule on the 8th then have all Tuesdays and Thursdays on the schedule and assign topics now or after listening sessions.
Amanda – after listening.
Liz – clear our schedule and meetings on April 8, 10, 15, 17, 22, 24, and 29. The materials that will be prepared for the topics will generally be information previously used to present the budget – we will revise that information because that’s what we have, but we have guidance of the Finance Committee, and Oscar will lead the discussion? Like the topics of..
oscar -0 I suggest we meet on the 8th for public engagement, and first meeting topic would be to discuss what we heard, and a general discussion, then I’ll know what to do with the other meetings.
Isaac – I want to base it on input we get from the public.
Liz – it will be similar to this evening.
Amanda – one meeting should be about revenue production – early, so we can find solutions.
Isaac – what RTM said, there were some themes around financial planning. I’d suggest RTM feedback be a meeting and the Finance Committee – that may take more than one meeting. There may be followups. I want to give us time to get into that aspect.
Liz – I agree, but we also heard many comments about the police, so we have to have a session about safety. We need a session about solid waste. yes to the structural, Fiancne Committee, savings and revenue – maybe on the 10th.
Oscar – I’d like one agenda item to be us sharing our thoughts.
Liz – the public will want to share their thoughts.
Oscar – one of the first topics be – what do we think, what is on our minds, how do we want to attack this?
Peter – I’m sort of hearing that the first meeting we listen and get feedback. If no one mentions something we don’t need a meeting on it. If the public wants something discussed it moves up the priority list; I know how I feel, but voices didn’t;t all share my vision. Maybe people tell us what they want and what they don’t want. Scattershotting with a billion topics will slow this down and we need to move quickly.
Liz – so we have a general idea – the first would be structural, then an internal discussion after the public listening.
Oscar – is there any way that John doesn’t have to be at every meeting, or have someone sub for him? I don’ want to condemn him to it.
Potter – the biggest amount of work will be between the meetings. If we don’t know the topics until the 10th, I have to do work the week of the 14th, so it will be the 21st when you see it.
Liz – solid waste isn’t an issue? But the police budget…
Amanda – solid waste needs a meeting. 8th listening, then make the list of topics.
oscar – police and trash will be two topics… so prepare them a little for the 15th.
Amanda – two topics in the same meeting??
Liz – police will need its own meeting. So, listening, then revenue sources and potential and finance committee and structural issues and results of listening session. List by the 8th for John. He has other questions. I’d assume we’d start from the previously approved budget without the human services funding until the end. We’ll do our budget then do the 2% RTM likes.
Oscar – it is 2% of last year. $461k. Either way – the approved budget or the base budget we’ll consider the cuts in different ways. So, either way…
Liz – there are also cuts John suggested that weren’t acted upon.
Oscar – either way we;’ll have the same conversation.
Potter – all the reductions the last board made – it was a ton of work to make it line up. If you generally want to do more than half of those reductions, work from the submitted budget. If less than half of the reductions are of interest, then go back to the base budget. It will be more work, but…
Liz – we’ll work from this. What else – do we want to identify services… no, not there yet.
Isaac – the last item. It would be good for us to see the 22% increase budget, and and what the cuts were.
Liz – yes. A handy way is he finance report has that list of the cuts that were made. This is a list of cuts that were not made. I’d like to revisit it. The base budget could be sent around.
Potter – looking at the lists will be easiest.
Liz – so we have cuts that were made and were not made.
Amanda – is it worth, asking departments to look at budgets one more time?
Potter – we found $3 million that they came up with. Beyond that we are getting into staff layoffs and reductions in force. I’d rather that come from you and not the department heads. Leadership sets policy.
Liz – the issue I have, and applauded Daniel for, we don’t want to have people on the auction block. The way this info is presented it is service-based. We should discuss that before we discuss people. That way it is more polite to discuss the service rather than the person performing it. I’d rather not get into the nitty gritty – we have the policy role and he has the authority over the personnel. John has identified services in each department, which is a great way to start the discussion. Do we need daisies on people’s birthday’s.
Amanada – it is all stuff we want we just can’t afford it.
Liz – a very lean budget of services we’d like to have in town and we need to come to terms with all the various things RTM said and translate it into what services are integral, what are nice to have if we can afford them. That’s where we are. It is not going to be the most pleasant exercise. We’ll have to dig deep.
Oscar – I’ll hold most of my thoughts for later. This is one of the first big things we’ll have to discuss as a board. Not pleasant to hear about your job discussed on TV. No one at RTM voted down the budget because we provide too many services. The number was too high. I’m struggling with..I’d rather a department head, if you had to, what cuts would you make would be least damaging to the mission?
(ed. they did this long ago… they are very lean departments)
Liz – that’s already been accomplished. It should come from John. He’s in charge of the staff. He can speak for the staff. He should identify what cuts to make.
Oscar – I agree. John did a great job of finding all cuts without touching staffing…
Liz – but it won’t come from department heads. We reviewed their budgets all fall. We have a month.
John – what you are asking for, Oscar, we could work into an FY27 development process, thoughtfully and really thinking it through. There are services that we canfigure out how to do without. We do it all because someone wanted it to be done.When we peel it back it will have reprocussions in the community. Be honest about what it will mean and take more time and do it well.
Liz – I read the RTM Finance Committee Report – there were recommendations for adding to the budget. We need to reconcile ourselves to that. Some might want more paving, or more reserve funds. What if it was voted down for not spending enough. WE might have a budget that is higher…
Peter – we are not having that conversation
Amanda – Daniel asked for 10% overall – a specific amount.
Liz – and we got from 22% to 12%. There is another page of cuts. John could look for additional cuts. He would like to know, policy-wise, of the things in the memo, we might not want to go into that tonight. next time we meet, well, the time after that we should identify service areas in town government that may or may not be essential.
Oscar – we often talk about what you can do without. The thing that is difficult is to know opportunities for reductions.
Liz – those are suggestions we can make and Potter will come back with answers.
Oscar – we had a long conversation this morning.
Liz – ah, the next …
Isaac – 6 and 7 – what additional info and what process – those are big picture. I’m interested to hear what people have to say.
Potter – I feel like a lot of the conversation tonight was about the process… I got the list of meetings and what that might look like.
ASL – it is hard to understand who is speaking. Say your names please…
(sound goes off for zoom listeners…)
(board keeps discussing unaware)
ASL – you muted the room.
Isaac – I’d like to hear if other board members have thoughts on process. And what other info you need, so he has time to develop it.
Liz – I’d like to see info from VLCT about budgets, or other things.
Amanda – I have 10 steps to achieve a structural budget…
Liz – we’ll put that in the packet
Amanda – or even to the public!
Neil – I’d ask that many people had limited knowledge of what was going on. No general idea of the whole working of the thing. We had some pre-RTM meetings in our districts and people discussed what was coming up. Include RTM so they show up and are intelligent and can make an intelligent vote.
Martha G – it feels like this is setting us up to relitigate the same arguments. It is difficult about the police. People talk past each other. They say the same things. Maybe instead of talking about the police, we talk about values. People moved here for arts, not police. You could make a survey and have voters say a positive statement of their values and what they want it to look like. Cutting the Arts fund in an Arts town might not be agreeable to our values. This has divided us as neighbors. We all want a great place. Restructure how we talk about it, and public comments. Not the same people getting entrenched, and express something positive. Start with values – a positive statement of what they do want.
Liz – I like having the same conversation over and over again.
Ken Fay – New hires – is the finance director hire near, or assistant town manager position not posted yet? Is that not being filled?
Liz – TBD. Let’s have a break.And be back at 9 pm.
FY26 pt II
Liz gavels us back into session.
Liz – Heidi? (gavel, gavel)
Heidi – that you all. It is an enormous job and a lot of time and energy. We asked you and we appreciate it. It shouldn’t be a rediscussion. We voted the budget down for new eyes and ideas – some are doing it and some are resistant to it. We asked for new eyes and new approaches. Some things you have to look ta, but be open to this process. I sense resistance from the center of the table nd you aren’t listening to the new members and they aren’t being heard …
Liz – we are having a listening sessions and other otopics, so I don’t see where I’m prohibiting new ideas…
Cristina – I was with you Liz on not having a listening session and having this process in an elect board meeting. the feedback about process is that we want to see that deliberation, collaborative. We want to hear you go through these things and have room to hear from the public but don’t start with a listening session – we want to hear from you. We haven’t heard from you. You’ve heard form us since last fall. There’s not a lot for us to say. I’d like to hear from the new members, then feedback can come from the new direction. Separate the idea that public safety and police are synonymous. You can’t police your way out of this. Public safety is a lot more than our police department.
Liz – listening session early or late?
Pete – it’s been asked and answered. I don’t not see the merit in it. Three new people are on the board, if you voted for them they share your values. There is merit in having a listening session. We have a lot of work to re-do. We won’t have a magical set of new numbers. We have to look at what’s there and if there is something people don’t want, I want to hear it first, before I feel from these board members. It might reframe the way we approach it. We have a town to run. This works doesn’t forgo other things that pops up in real time, so in the next two months we will also address own issues. I hope we can handle more than one thing. All respect. I don’t agree or disagree. RTM turned it down, and are you. Come to us and tell us why you turned it down. Open meetings. Everyone can weigh in at any time.
Dick Degray – a couple of things. I think you are rolling the dice only having one RTM meeting. I’d think you’d have the meeting so you could have enough of a window to have another before the 30th of June. Might take some work. I watched the whole meeting. If RTM was hellbent on reducing the budget, they would have voted to level fund it… RTM wants a different look with 3 new board members. Amanda is right to ask department heads to relook at budgets and offer any suggestions. It’s unfair to the police, fire, and DPW to bear the brunt of all the total reductions . I think you’ll end up at 10%. In your packet – the worst case scenarios – no one mentioned it. I was embarrassed. I don’t know who wrote them? Did department heads? Was AI used? I made a stamens in January about the sky falling and that’s the first thing that I felt when I saw it. Was this an April Fools joke? You have an 83 year old couple, struggling to pay taxes, they have a 2.5% increase in social security, but this goes up… that’s a real life issue. people are struggling to pay taxes on the places where they live. You can’t say we can’t do something. You won’t know for a year what the impact is for a service cut. But you can’t sit there and talk about preserving services. The previous board disn[t want to cut staff. Discretionary spending won’t get you where you want to go. It may come to staff. But you can’t have sacred lambs here. Everything has to be on the table. I appreciate the bard – RTM wants a new look at the budget and the new board member suggestions are almost being rebuffed. When did you schedule the RTM meeting? (final week of May) Reconsider it. If the budget fails, you’ll go into the new year and borrow money. I’d try to get two RTM meetings in, and tell RTM that the process for the next year is underway and that’s where it is at. Don’t roll the dice with one meeting.
Liz – good suggestion and we should keep it in mind.
Oscar – could we schedule two meetings and cancel the second if it passes?
Liz – with department heads, John should do that for him. I’d rather it come from him. We don’t have time for discussions with all of them.
Eric – I tried to be remembered of being cogent. At the start of the meeting we looked at the amazing work of the town. We have amazing town employees. However, when faced with a challenge they have the skills… as an educator we had to look at budget cuts. professionals can do it. Next, do you expect to see a dead person at the library with a 2 year old by your side. Do you expect to be ignored, wait days,… these are the doomsday things in the memo. Those are threats. We have been shamed and threatened into looking into changing this budget. I’d like professionalism from this town manager.
– I read those scenarios . Those have happened in those towns. That happens in the library. The police haven’t responded to me. They’ve had to put me off. I’ve had them leave me to go deal with someone in a bigger crisis. They aren’t made up and have happened in this town.
Cristina – one one hand, RTM voted down the budget – when I went to pay my property taxes last year I went down with a horrified look on my faces and got in line with lots of others. It is a real fear to not be able to pay this and make my basic needs. That fear of a 12% increase on top of last year’s increase. Some is apocalyptic, and some already happens. People drive down the middle of the road to dodge potholes. We already live in that town. Let us stay involved.
Tim C – thanks Dick. Some historical perspective to the reserve fund. 20 years ago we didn’t have a reserve fund. The general fund at budget time a free for all. The finance committee at the time was looking at the overall structure of how things were managed. WE came up with the idea for a reserve fund. Done with Town and VT bond fund managers. The FC at the time did an ordinance , sent it to the selectboard, and adopted it. The intent was to provide a buffer for dire emergency. Not a slush fund. Not there to be spent. It is there for a buffer for that emergency waiting for federal grants for disaster relief. So when the town doesn’t understand the fund’s purpose, to increase our credit with the bond fund, and protect the population under dire circumstance. It seems to me that the original purpose has been forgotten. I haven’t looked at the last budget line by line, or at the FC report, or the original ordinance. It was to be a percentage of the overall budget. When you look at the next budget, bear in mind the reserve fund is there for a specific reason. It’s not a slush fund for operational expenditure. It’s there to protect the ongoing fiscal situation for the town of Brattleboro. Also, to control the budget. The budget needed to be cut to match those funds, and that still applies now. I can’t be here for the meetings you proposed, but look at why it was set up.
Oscar – we did talk about the spending of the fund and quote the guideline.
Trish – I want to rasie a comment pointed out by the Finance Committee – we are in a tight and difficult situation, in the town and nationally. One thing we really really need is the ability to look backwards and forward in what the needs are. The FC has said OpenGov doesn’t have the historical data, and we don’t have a 25 year look forward at our capital needs. We can’t forecast forward. I expect it to be hard to get any of that done, but get it in the future…
Kate O. – I want to mention one thing of the listening session – it should be clear is the goal is to reduce the budget and making changes to the budget. You need to listen for what RTM wanted and the long term implications of what this budget means in years beyond. Set the stage that this is a serious listening session and it is the best way to work out FY26 in the bigger context of long term forecasting.
Fric – I don’t envy any of you. I agree with Cristina about public safety is not equal to police. We need creative ways to solve problems we are facing – police, diversionary boards and other resources for genuine problems. We need to get creative and get real. As far as the budget goes, get creative and get real results. We can plan for what we know and what we can guess. Don’t need every detail of the next five years but we should look five years ahead. We should look at capital expenditures, and using people on staff for projects. A long term budget plan or trajectory you could sell a higher budget for the short term – if you have the five year plan in mind.
Genesee – the list of cuts not made – do we have those? Budget should be informed by staff but needs to come from political leadership. Not everyone is looking for a smaller overall budgets. They want changes in budget priorities. There should be one listening session and two RTM special meetings, be we need a cautionary statement for civil meetings. I heard threats of violence. they have no place in civil procedure. RTM members need to be informed and kept in the loop about finalizing the budget.
Susan – some real frustration. The tax bills last year – big increase in the diction tax. Where was the outrage then? WE are focused on the town vs on the State school education tax. It’s the highest portion of the tax bill. I’m frustrated that the state got away with adding tons of programs that we are all paying for now but we can’t keep essential services in our town. the state has done this to us repeatedly. No resources for us in the motel program.
Liz – I share your frustration and hope we will post out the school portion. We need revenue sharing before the motel program. Degray talked about it 15 years ago. We are a host town to almost 300 people who need care, getting social services but no discussion of revenue sharing for the costs we bear.
Kate – the school budget went down this year. They lowered the school budget this year.
Liz – we should take advantage of that when we uneaten the municipal spending we have. How many more people?
Martha – I have had conversations for years with selectboard members that other towns in the program charged the motel owners for law enforcement services that came from those properties. Rutland, Williston… there was some Act 250 thing that prevented us. We should look at things the state has put on us – hub town, host town, 1st town over the line, the Retreat, homelessness… it’s not just this town. Maybe John could update us on what we think the state should pay and why.
Liz – revenue sharing was number 1 goal last year… didn’t address it. It was my pet project. Integral to our public safety plan. All those legislative issues… we have discussed that with hem and need to do it again.
Martha – let us know and let us do it.. talk about it. Other towns got $20k+ a month…
Liz – definitely on the agenda. When we talk about community safety we’ll talk with the legislators. They could be the answer to our budget but it is not clear yet.
Amanda – when the delegation comes here, come up, look them in the eye. Write them and call them.
Liz – we got a notice about the motel program. We were just notified. When she told us people were ineligible, it was changed by the governor. She told me that ineligible people they are no longer eligible, but there are another 900 people on a waiting list who are eligible. The program is not being reduced. other people will be placed in those hotel rooms. Our host duties are ultimately expanded not reduced.
Oscar – anyone waiting for the bike stuff?
– we just voted on that issue
Liz – shall we move along? Notices about budget will all be presented…
Bike Lanes
Sue and Alice discuss a new bike plan for Western Ave.
I, however, must wrap this up. Kittens call…
POTENTIAL MOTION: TO AUTHORIZE THE RE-PAINTING OF THE BIKE LANES ON WESTERN AVENUE BETWEEN GREEN STREET AND EXIT 2 WITH THE 2025 PAVING PROJECT SUCH THAT PARKING WILL BE ON ONLY THE SOUTH SIDE OF THE AVENUE AND THE BIKE LANES WILL BE STRAIGHT ON EITHER SIDE, PERHAPS INCLUDING A BUFFER IF THERE IS SPACE.
Poop and needles
Far be it from me to defend a doofus landlord, but the guy suggesting the selectboard come down and help clean up the poop and needles left by junkies breaking in was hilarious. I guarantee that if the people in charge had to deal with the daily consequences of fent zombies, everything we currently hear is “complex” would get very simple, very fast.