Join members of Brattleboro’s Representative Town Meeting body for a day of deliberations over passage of the Town and School District budgets.
The meeting starts at 8:30 AM but we’ll have the stream up at 8:00 AM so you can check it out ahead of time. At any point if your stream gets behind (this can happen if you pause the feed, or if it needs to buffer) just click the ‘Live’ button in the bottom left and it will skip you ahead.
Click here to find out more at the Town Rep page at brattleboroTV.org.
getting started
Good morning. It’s Representative Town Meeting Day.
Things are just getting underway. They have a preliminary motion to accept guests into the reserved section, but…
There is a motion to amend that members of the boards be seated with the main body. Members are debating whether they should follow the Charter, or tradition. At issue is whether the boards take/are given any extra status by sitting at special tables in front of the others.
As is often the case at these events, a member asks to call the question before debate is over. It’s a technique used to speed things up, but it can slow things down by requiring votes to see if if debate shall cease. In this case, they vote and it’s too close for the moderator to determine, so they also do a second count.
Cease debate? 91-33 so debate ceases. (2/3 needed)
Question on Amendment – that board members and officials be seated with the main body?
Defeated the amendment. Back to the original motion about people sitting with the body. Yes, guests can enter the reserved area.
Preliminary Motion 2 – electronic media to stay in reserved section? Yes!
Article I – accept audit reports? – approved!
Article II – can we use a certified accountant? – approved!
Article III – appoint Annette Cappy as Town and Town School Clerk for a year? approved!
Article IV – appoint John O’Connor as Town and Town School District Treasurer? approved!
Article V – appoint Fisher & Fisher as Town Attorney for a year? approved.
Article VI – to elect 3 reps to capital grant review board. Nominated from the floor. Any nominations?
silence
Any suggestions? asks the moderator? Anyone who would like to do the job?
Betsy Gentile nominated George Hertzog. Second!
Sherry Manning nominated Steven Phillips. Second!
– what does the board do? asks a rep…
Town Manager Ewell says they occasionally review potential grant applications to see about ongoing operation and maintenance costs for the community.
Hertz and Phillips are appointed to the Cap. Grant Review Board.
Town Finance Committee
(I’d like to pre-apologize for any spelling error. I’m typing fast, and the spell correct is changing some names on me.)
Article VII – appointing members to Town Finance Committee. Nominations?
Franz Reichsman nominated himself. Cheers!
Tad Montgomery nominates Avery Schwenk.
Ralph Meima nominated himself. Applause.
George Reed-Savory nominates Maya Hasagawa.
Paula Melton nominated herself. Applause.
“On a roll,” says the moderator.
Ricky Davidson nominates Kerri Storm.
point of order regarding committee and it’s origins. The moderator was to make the appointments, and the body was not supposed to nominated, says Me. Corbeil.
Moderator says RTM can fix number of members, compensation, and duties and functions. Moderator did appoint for a while, but we have volunteers this year. Says Charter allows us to appoint as many as we choose.
Nominations accepted and closed. All nominees appointed! 6 member committee!
Correct spelling of my name
For future reference, the Last name is Hasegawa.
Article 8/9
Article 8 – to appoint Brooks Library Trustees – Pamela Becker, Howard Burrows, Jane Southworth, and two others (Connie and Jenny) for unexpired terms. Seconded and approved. Appointed!
Article 9 – To amend Town Charter to change deadline for incumbent RTM members to place names on ballot, no later than the 8th Monday preceding the election. Moved and seconded.
Spoon Agave – says the 6th Monday. Is that state law?
Town Clerk Cappy – it is state law for others. This changes incumbent deadline to line up with other deadlines.
Agave – Traditionally it has been he 6th. A new change is going on – early voting is widespread. When we don’t require them until the 6th, but early voting is used 30 days ahead. That give little time for candidates to reach all voters before voting occurs.
Cappy – state deadlines are way ahead. we’re just talking of local elections.
Agave – me, too. Absentee ballots used to be a slim number. It’s getting larger. Elections will be over until election day.
Cappy – need to have =names and ballots before they can vote.
Everyone needs to address the moderator, says Manning(?) (a guy)
Moderator – shall we change the deadline….? approved.
Officer Salaries and Amendments -- Should SB get a big raise?
Article 10 – Amend charter – passed
Article 11 – Borrowing – passed
Article 12 – Salaries for officers – passed
Kurt Daims wants to see salaries raised to a make the Selectboard a “seriously paid position.” $20,000 per annum ($25k for chair). Makes job available to people who can’t afford to volunteer that much time without compensation. Moved and seconded. Dylan MacKinnon says that he couldn’t run for SB because he can’t afford it. Ms. Hollaway asks how many hours the SB actually expend on their jobs as something that should be established before giving raises. Allen Manning also asks how many hours the SB takes.
David Schoales says it’s hard to tell as it is variable — but assumes that in a normal year, it’s about 4 hours a week for reading plus the meeting time. But this year they’ve been “practically living together.” Manning said that since $20k is about a half-time salary so it seemed quite reasonable to him to raise the salary since it takes about 20 hours per week.
George Carvill said he would be open to providing childcare to SB members who need it but not necessarily giving them big raises. Another citizen said that SB members who didn’t need the money could donate it back to the town.
Judy Davison of District 3 said that being on the board was challenging due to public opinion as well as the hours required. She wonders how many people really want to be on the board, but would be prevented for financial reasons.
Paula Melton asked if salary increases for the SB would pass, would the budget need to be amended. Mr. Elwell replied that yes, $88,000 would need to be added to the budget.
Spoon Agave said that when he was young he believed that in the end, everything would work out. When the charter was created, he said, that worked. But today, the world is a much more complex place. We need high quality leadership, he said. He said he wasn’t sure a few hours a week is enough for that kind of leadership. “We do need a lot more than what we can get,” he said. If $20,000 would move us toward a more engaged leadership, he would support that.
Peter Fallion said that it was necessary to improve ongoing communication between the town and its leaders. He invoked Ken Schneck who was in favor of using social media to connect leadership to citizens in town. Fallen said that he felt that communication modes needed to be brought up to the 21st century. The new generation, he said, work harder and longer than people his age did when they were young. He wants the SB to communicate with citizens during the meeting via social media — something to consider, he says, as a way to engage citizens and maybe encourage future leaders.
Crisps gently reminds the members to confine their comments to the question at hand.
George Harvey said that to give the SB members a big raise would be, in effect, a windfall for current members who didn’t expect it and that the town should consider this at a later time.
Margaret Atkinson took issue with professionalizing local SB and school board positions saying it would bring in a professional class of governing workers. We might be opening the door to professional politicians coming in, and becoming “very comfortable in their positions, which prevents change from happening.” [Applause]
Brandie Starr said that her child care costs $3000/month, to put the stipend into perspective.
Dora Bouboulis said that professionalizing the job is a lot more money than $20k — a low end professional salary is $50k.
Don Webster is sympathetic to the issues raised but wanted to amend the question to have the SB investigate the issue of officer compensation and report back next year. It’s a serious issue and we should study it, he said.
Daims says it isn’t a friendly amendment, and it is illegal to assign that duty to another branch of government.
(Thanks to Lise for the above while I did morning errands! – cg)
Town Atty says compensation is voted on by RTM, but Webster is asking to study the issue. It’s appropriate as long as RTM votes on the outcome.
Barber says RTM sits and government of the Town, then we act as government of Town School District, and each has different tax rates. Says Selectboard should study its piece and school board should study its piece.
Sharry Manning says RTM has already increased compensation, so why study it? Gartenstein says select board salaries were increased. He says people can come to Selectboard meetings to help set the agenda for RTM.
Webster would like to have each board study this issue, and Selectboard can decide how to study their portion and report back.
Franz Reichsman suggests defeating both amendments. He promises the Finance Committee will look into it over the next year. There is support for this idea.
Stuart Copans – we don’t pay them, we give them a present for our appreciation of their work. Professionalizing has serious implications in our all-volunteer state.
Roni Byrne – with issues like this, I’m disinclined to vote on decisions just brought up on the floor now. If it comes up next year, I can talk to people in my district and vote accordingly. I urge defeat of both.
Webster – since the Finance Committee will study this, I withdraw my amendment. So withdrawn.
They then voted through the two remaining options:
Mr. Daims – I was hoping someone would make amendment to make this effective next election cycle. Chair says the motion stands as is.
On the Daims amendment – fails.
On the article 12- it is approved.
Next up: Article 13 – DID assessment
!
I got invoked!
Article 13 - DID
Shall the DID be required to pay $78,000 special assessment for DID? Yes, it is approved.
Article 14, and Recess
Article 14 – special assessment for Mountain Home Park for paying debt on water and sewer lines of $223, 276.48.
M. Bosworth suggests in future years the impact on homeowners in Mountain Park should be noted. After Irene, people moved out, so each current owner owes more as a result, he says.
Mike Corbeil – how long will this be on our agenda? TM Elwell says 18 more years to go. There was some deferral of payments. Initial term was 20 years, but 18 years remain. Corbeil says he thinks many people don’t know what this article is about, and that Mountain Home residents pay this. Elwell confirms Town is the underwriter, but the assessment is on owners in the trailer park.
Article 14 is approved!
RTM takes a 10 minute recess
Same As It Ever Was
Nice musical snippets during the break for us watching online. Talking Heads covers, Snaz… : )
I have to say, this room seems much better for the RTM than the high school gym. I think they have better meetings here as a result.
More soon!
Article 15 - Climate protection
Article 15 – shall we spend $10,000 for Brattleboro Climate Protection? (as we have been doing for many years?)
Jane Southworth – I don’t understand the relationship between this and the Town Energy Committee. Does this money support both or either?
TM Ewell – funds support of non-profit Brattleboro Climate Protection, not the committee, but helps the committee.
Ralph Meima – in favor of funding and keeping this going. As member of the Energy Committee for many years, Paul Cameron provides an incredible service of long-term support and institutional memory that helps the committee. Brattleboro has been able to update streetlights, save money and energy, and help with solar energy transition. Going smoother here than in other parts of the state.
Mollie Burke – also support this. Paul does an an amazing job. We owe him a great deal and he’s saved the town a great deal of money.
Michael Bosworth – agree with others. Paul has been a great resource and help to Energy Committee. As a nonprofit, he can apply for grant funds that help the town. Energy Audit report on municipal buildings is available. A Wealth of useful detail and recommendations. next we’ll look at funding these projects. We’ll have to spend money to save money.
Article is approved!
Article 16 - human service programs
Article 16 – $120,000 to support human service programs as so listed…?
Jill Stahl-Tyler – people have asked me, all of these are non-profits, right? We already give to them so why should our taxes going to non-profits?
Gartenstein – Vermont Law authorizes organizations to make requests. We have them make requests to a Review Committee, then make a group recommendation to RTM for consideration. This is supplemental to any personal contributions.
Prudence MacKinney – it’s a good practice and it is a small amount of valuable support.
Peter Falion – I support this. The process is remarkable, with transparent criteria, informational meetings for potential grantees. The money is well-monitored. Not just handing money over. Many of these organizations provide services to other towns and get money in other town meetings, too. Thanks committee members for their hard work.
– this also helps orgs get grants – shows support from town.
K. Turnas – we are grateful for what Town gives us for Senior Meals – we do Meals on Wheels and senior meals. If everyone donated it would be great, but we need town money as things are now.
Spoon Agave – This is what we do as a town. In old town reports in 1920’s – a large percentage of town money helped town poor, medical expenses. What we contribute now is small by comparison. With unions, benefits came and we could drop back.. Historically we take care of those in the community that have needs.
Dan Kaznitz – lead term is non-profit, but they are social profit is what they are. More valuable than fiscal profit.
E. Kornheiser – Committee is careful. Look at exemptions, if they require the funds, number of Brattleboro residents served, if they can get other grants instead. It’s very well reviewed.
Leo Schift – VT Wilderness School? New this year?
Kornheiser – rare for a new org to apply. There is a child care crisis in summers for school age children. There are few options. VT Wilderness is trying to serve low income so parents can work and kids can enjoy summer.
Article approved!
Article 17 - SeVEDS
16 was unanimous, by the way.
Article 17 – $25,000 to SeVeEDS from program income fund?
Bob Stevens – chair of SeVEDS. Formed 9 years ago – a regional group to identify issues and a strategy to add jobs to the community, and economic growth. Current issues – VY closing, green building cluster, precision manufacturing, business incubating, and workforce development so companies can grow. Programs for young people. It’s a long process to improve the community and find jobs for people who grow up here, so we can grow the grand list and reduce taxes.
Allyssa – the initial request was $3 a person, and Brattleboro suggested $2?
Gartenstein – I recall.. we’ve learned that economic development has to happen regionally. But, Brattleboro has finance issues that caused me to vote for $2. In summary, VT doesn’t provide regional economic hubs to raise revenue to defray our expenses so our taxes aren’t disproportionately high. Our taxes have to support activities for entire region. We’re already paying to support economic dev in town and we do it in many ways. So we thought lower the amount made sense.
E. Kornheiser – the goal of regional stimulus is laudable. I agree we’re a hub. How much money comes from other communities to SeVEDS?
Stevens – 9 communities had it at RTM. All but Londonderry supported it (they went with manchester). All went with $3 amount.
Adam Grinold – of SeVEDS/BDCC. (Gives amounts for each town, $51k total)
Gartenstein – source of funds is from program income, not from taxes. It’s money given back from block grant loan repayment.
Peter Falion – Could we know more about plans this hub has with other hubs. We’re not the only ones…any effort for hubs to champion and advocate at state level?
Gartenstein – Yes! The study group just finished up, gave report, and we’re now reaching out to other hubs to form a coalition to work together to develop an agenda for tax fairness. We’ll need to work with legislators. Our tax rate is $1.17. Other towns around us have some in 30-40 cent range.
Holloway – need clarification – If not from taxes, why not do $3 a person?
Elwell – we have $400,000 or so. I recall that there were two other factors in the decision – One is levels of funding of Brattleboro vs. region. Brattleboro helped with a challenge grant, we’ve made other contributions. Second – there is $400k, but it serves for direct support for economic dev projects and housing projects. There are other needs that we need to use the fund for. There was a concern that giving more, now, for the general effort would reduce what we could use for the other projects. Haven’t denied any projects. Gave $200k to GS Precision this year, andsmaller amounts for matching grants and loans.
Schoales – We pushed SeVEDS to get money from other towns. Brooks House, Hermit Thrush… types of things we give money to. The idea is to loan it out and get it back to use again. Less we grant, the better for getting it back.
It is approved!
Article 18 - special spending
Article 18 – $449, 225 from unassigned fund balance for Bonnyvale Retaining Wall, Swimming Pool repairs, and reducing tax levy?
Gartenstein – This is in conjunction with the budget question for town as a whole. We had over $2 million in fund balance. Have a 10% of town budget for emergency. So we have a bit of an excess in fund balance. We’re trying to pay for capital expenses that reoccur in regular budgets. One time repairs can come out of a surplus. Two projects foot the bill. One is retaining wall, and one is phase one of LMP pool repairs. Big ticket items out of surplus. Hope to fund them with grants and not need all this. We debated spending any to defray taxes, and thought we should spend half this year, and half next year. Next year will have higher taxes due to police fire borrowing. This might help smooth tax increases over coming years. We should be able to do the same next year.
Paula Melton – question about Elliot Street bridge. It’s not on the list.
Gartenstein – VT swooped in and will replace it starting July 1 at little expense to us.
Elwell – RTM authorized money for four potential projects. Union Hill came in under budget, Elliot bridge will be low cost, and retaining wall got state funding… the sum total has left most of the money to life safety improvements at the municipal center.
Article 18 approved! Unanimous.
Article 19 - Town budget
Article 19 – To raise and spend $16,288,258 to defray general fund expenses.
Gartenstein – This budget covers all expenses in the general fund for coming fiscal year. It provides for level service. Some changes in the way we approach expenses – less long term borrowing for ongoing operations. We have debt payments on vehicles. We can move away from borrowing for these due to sound fiscal management, squeezing the budget tightly. Budget is somewhat more than was at info meeting 10 days ago, because RTM voted to move the police station to Black Mtn Rd. This now includes debt service for 176k (1.5 on tax rate increase, to 3.32 cent increase total) for first year. Municipal tax is 45% of tax rate. School district takes up more. Big part of school tax is controlled by the state. If school is approved, the total tax rate may decrease by 8 cents on a hundred. Very good year to begin police fire project. Even with increased borrowing, we may see a tax decrease this year.
Steve Phillips – SB had some debate about lack of this floor on Central Fire for future expansion. Could you explain what it would take to add it back in, so it can be an option in the future? Also, if amendment is not made, is there a possibility that the board will seek other savings to do it anyway?
Gartenstein – Not in favor, but here’s the info: the cost to include the support for a third floor is about $170k. The cost of additional borrowing to support it would be about $4k. The $4k could be located in the budget. Adding $170k to project is more difficult proposition.
Daims – I move to reduce budget by $176,906K…. the debt service amount.
Crispe – in adding numbers, the $176k represents a number equal to the debt service. (Clarifies the amount of the new budget when it is subtracted).
Daims – I asked Chief for fire stats, and fire dept is reducing number of fire calls. Are fire calls down by 40%?
Chief Bucossi – Not so simple. 1998-2012 info. In 1998 we did 470 fire calls, and in 2012 we did 270 fire calls. There is a reduction of almost 200 calls. But, these are single year comparisons. Between those years… on average over 27 years, we make 403 fire calls with a high of 1994 545 and low of 249 in 2012. Over 27 years, a steady increase in total calls for request for assistance. High is 2440 in 2011, 935 in 1992. A slight drop in fire calls, but on local level is we do aggressive fire prevention program, and an inspection program. Fires are smaller today with better equipment and faster response times. Daims says staff is up nationwide. We’ve had no increases here since I started. It’s down by one.
Daims – Brattleboro proudly bucks the trend in employment. (He starts showing a presentation with charts and diagrams).
Tom Franks – how is this germane?
Crispe – Daims is offering amendment to reduce total budget by $176…k He can speak to his rational and reasoning as to why you should consider the reduction. Must stay to the budget, and must respect other’s time.
Daims – talks about fire department’s changing role, better technology, less smoking, fewer fires. Our project to expand the station is outdated. We need to focus more on education and other efforts. The proposal is like the navy adding more battleship – it is obsolete. The project has been off on the wrong start since the beginning. No consideration of fixing problems. The first meeting agenda – nothing but building matters. Construction was the only option. Here is a list of options beside building (nothing on page). Here is a town memo saying the cost has come down. It’s nearly doubled!
Kaznitz – two minutes is up and displays don’t speak to modification of motion.
Crispe. He’s got a point. You can reduce the budget but can’t direct where to apply the reduction. Select board has authority to decide. Your reduction would be advisory. One minute to wrap up.
Daims – Selectboard has misinformed us, censoring news that funding is not absolute. The finds can be directed to other capital expenses. They denied this and censored me. The bond counselor says the bonds can be spent for anything that bonds can be used for. They can be redirected. Thanks.
Marshall Wheelock – Daims said we did have a earlier bill at $10m. 16 years later it has grown to $14-15m. The need continues to be there. Don’t see economy going into deflation. The longer we wait the more it will cost us.
Schoales calls the question on the amendment.
Debate ceases. Vote on motion to reduce budget..? RTM says no.
Back to the budget as it was.
Spoon Agave – the one part that is absent. There is no information on the other part of town. People in TriPark, Moore Court, Melrose. It’s a large part of our town. I can afford this this year, but have to ask what’s my responsibility on the rest of the community. No information in this report. They are out of sight. Pushing the poor out of sight. They aren’t rioting, so everything must be okay, we say. Disappointed that I cannot take into consideration a large part of the community as I know nothing of their circumstances.
Hyam Siegel – there is a petition to have the article put to town wide referendum. If that succeeds, what happens to the money we allocate in this budget?
Elwell, if that comes to pass, the town would have no authority to issue the debt to proceed with project at Black Mtn Rd. There would have to be new consideration by board. They could work under existing approval to do work at Municipal Center. This amount is lower than the Municipal Center. RTM would likely have to weigh in.
Siegel – looking forward to another meeting!
Eric Schmidt – I came from the hidden part of town. People who haven;t been there have no idea what it is like. median acme her is 32k, median household is 44k, Fedear poverty line is about $24k for family of four. 62% of kids here qualify for free or reduced school lunched. 62% of children are in families that makes less. This body over represent the better off in town. Not opposed to the project. If we need it, we need it. Can we afford it? It’s gonna hurt. People don’t have much. What will they give up to fix what’s broke. I’m voting against the budget, not against the project. It should come out of other areas of the budget. We can get the tax rate down to a more sustainable level. Tax rebates are more generous for school taxes. Rating municipal rates impacts low income population more harshly.
Don Webster – closing in on 80-, so maybe I’m old fashioned. Most people in this country and at RTM are aware of economic differences, and many understand and feel it. It’s presumptuous to assume that people who are lower income aren’t interested in municipal services. They like police and fire services. Unfair to assume low income don’t want these services. They may want to pay for them more than wealthy people. This seems affordable. many people not here also want these services.
? – how many signatures would we need to get this to a town wide vote, re: petitions? To get a better sense of what people can afford.
Elwell- 50 RTM signatures, or 5% of total registered voters – about 400.
? – this is still an issue and this group doesn’t represent all the voters in Brattleboro. We want things to be adequate, but don’t want it moved.
Paula Melton – I sympathize with thinking of low income people. There are mechanisms for tax relief in low income housing. The problem is we don’t have enough of this housing. If voting down the budget would solve it I would vote it down, but it doesn’t.
M. Atkinson – I’m not 80, but… there is always concern for people’s ability to pay for things. On everyone’s mind. Gov’t is providing for collective services we can’t do individually. If you cut other public goods – parks, library, plowing – for the police, it isn’t productive. I think this is reasonable budget. Much deliberation in meetings. Let’s pass this budget.
George Harvey – miffed at idea we’re a homogenous group. I wondered if I should be homeless once, rather than pay rent. Let’s worry about the budget. We should talk about poor people, but it isn’t the budget.
Dylan MacKinnon – people I represent. On Valgar street fire street – it impacts them.
Bob Overhand? – how are tax increases offset?
Elwell – state program that caps the amount of property taxes paid by people making up to 27k a year(?). Then up to 97k, there is a limit on property tax so long as they are homesteads. We have lots of renters, and others who don’t qualify for the deal, but it helps those who can afford a home. State pays the difference.
C. Holloway – it’s 47k, not 27.
Elwell – right. More than half of homesteads are eligible.
Roni Byrne – the worksheet the state uses for rebates is baed on prior year’s income, not this year’s. And prior year’s property tax bill. Also, overall increase to property tax of $220k home would be $73.04 annually.
Andy Davis – Our budget isn’t the main driver of income disparity. The system works. We’re moving forward with a more conservative option for the facilities projects. Health insurance, student debt, public transportation – bigger needs. less pass this budget.
Article 19 budget approved!
Chair calls 1 hour recess. See you then.
Reassemble
Town Meeting Representatives are coming back in after break.
You can read this if you’d like to know more about the origins of Brattleboro’s Representative Town Meetings system.
Articles 20-25 - Exemptions
Article 20 – exempt Brattleboro Little League from municipal portion of taxes for 5 years?
Costello – On behalf of Post 5. The field is a treasure. The title is with the American Legion, since WWII. First players are now over 70 years old. Serves lots of people. It’s operated by the Little League organization in town. Cost of operating is over $10k, raised by them. About 72 kids and 6 teams. All who try out make the team. This all survives by private donations of time and money.
Jill Stahl-Tyler – question for all… how much are the taxes we are abating?
Crispe – on page 13 of the documents.
Jane Southworth – so far we have paid more time on spending than revenue. How are we limited by the state to raise revenue?
Elwell – I know where you are heading with this… the legal structure within how we can collect more revenue? OK. Dylan rule state. Municipalities can only do what state legislature allows us to do. Most states have more home rule. Municipalities can do anything that isn’t prohibited by the state. A big difference. Hard to find ways to collect revenue other than property taxes. That’s why we work on hub town issues. Central to that is working to obtain some degree of flexibility on how we collect revenue to operate local governments. Some additional home rule will be important.
Southworth, given that we are limited, I question abating municipal taxes on this one – it’s private non-profit that serves a few children. We already have many institutions that don’t pay taxes. We’re cutting off one hand while scrambling around with the other. I’m against it.
David Emery – I’m in favor. It’s about $1,100. We can’t do what is being done now in our Recs and Parks for this amount.
Edward Wright – past commander of the Post 5. If no exception, Recs and Parks won’t provide it, and Little League will end.
Kaznitz – plea in favor – the additional commerce brought in from the field will exceed the amount we exempt. It is a smaller number, but it expands beyond those who participate. Other lend their support, so it is easy to support.
Sarah Paige – is this field used by town other than little league? or could it?
David Sear – coordinator for Little League – we use it all summer, so time available would be fall. Liability only covers little league.
George Harvey – I’ve always hated competitive sports, and I had choice not to do them. It’s not just for 72 kids – it’s 72 that choose to go down there. We should support it.
K Dowd.- why do we decide this? And how much do we exempt otherwise around town from bigger places?
Fischer – these come before you for exemptions. Others by law apply to organizations or properties. These have to be approved.
Elwell – out of $1.2 billion on grand list, $250m in tax exemptions. value of exemptions approved today would be $2 m of value, plus farm stabilizations, other contracts, etc. Total value on what’s acted on locally is $48m then $201 million straight out of statutes. It’s part of being a hub – some non-profits that are eligible for state exemptions. $200 m of state exempted, and $48 m of town exempted value.
Bosworth – there will be more next year?
Elwell – this is the full list. The $48m also includes farms, other contracts. The few before you today represent a minority of what is exempted in town.
George Reed-Savory – does everybody that wants to play get to play in this league?
David Sear – 72 came out last year. We’ve had up to 150. We won’t turn any away. 9 year old will try out and some will stay in small fry. They’ll play baseball somewhere. Signups next week at Am Legion. We can expand teams. Parents went on strike and stopped having kids. Funnel us kids and we’ll provide the opportunity.
approved!
Article 21 – exempt Rescue Inc. from municipal portion of taxes for 5 years?
approved!
Article 22 – exempt municipal taxes for Camp Waubonong for 5 years?
Bosworth – are context – is this the only camp we have in town? Anything special?
E. Kornheiser – part of child care crisis – it’s an overnight or day camp – 8 am to 6 pm, which allows parents to work. They will reopen with increased capacity, solar energy, new buildings, working with wilderness school, and one of most economically diverse places for kids. Quite powerful.
Exempted!
Article 23 – exempt Holton Home for municipal taxes for 5 years?
Cindy Jerome – Holton Home pays the educational tax, we have a tight budget – now that Holton and Bradley have merged. Many can’t pay for their care. Currently investing in redevelopment of Bradley House.
Lee Stookey – difference between Holton Home and Holton Memorial? I see two listings, with different taxes for the two.
Jerome – Years ago our legal name was Holotn Memorial, but we’ve dropped that, so we’ll make sure the town has the info it needs.
Marshall Wheelock – Holton Memorial was granted an exemption years before any of us was born. Hilton Home is what we get to vote on.
Dr. Slowinski – others provide similar services, what about them?
Jerome – the only other residential care home in town is on 2nd floor of Thompson House, which is a nursing home.
Anne – are Hilltop and Bradley non-profit?
Jerome – yes. Both are public charities.
Judy Davidson – familiar with both, and both are assets to town, but I’m against this. It’s a lot of money over 5 years, and 75% are paying for access to their facilities. They have assets. This is a fair amount of revenue over 5 years.
approved!
Article 24 – exempt Bradley House from municipal portion of taxes for 5 years, and education for 2 years?
Brandie Starr – it is a big number, but much work is necessary to be done in the next few years. It helps offset the work that needs to be done.
Dora Bouboulis – reminder that we have tax agreements with profitable companies not paying taxes on portions of their buildings because they are expanding, like GS Precision. These places are not that profitable, but we give same agreement to for-profit companies. Selectbord votes but we don’t.
Ben Underhill – why 2 year on education tax?
Gartenstein – when organizations came seeking exemptions, two wanted full exemptions of municipal for 5 years. Board was reluctant to provide education tax relief – we have to pay the state if we do – but there was a need and we decided to recommend a partial education exemption.
Jerome – it’s hard to pay education taxes but our goal is to pay them. Working to get Bradley to be able to pay them. If we expand, our share of tax will be more after redevelopment.
Approved!
Article 25 – exempt The Family Garden from municipal taxes for 5 years, and education for 2 years?
Tom Franks – info on the Family Garden?
Crispe – I thought you’d call the question
Franks – sorry to disappoint.
S. Tomlinson – we are a non profit child care center, not affiliated with a religious institution. 76% are from Brattleboro, and many are low income. Trying to get to place to be able to pay, via grants and other sources, but need this for now.
Slowinski – could property taxes be done similar to social services funding, with pre-approvals by committee?
Elwell – the Selectboard did that by hearing the requests and vetting them at a meeting earlier in the year. That screening leads to these recommendations.
Approved.
So ends the Municipal portion of the meeting. Next up, schools!
Article 26, 27, 28 School Board Compensation, Borrowing & Grants
Article 26 – What salaries shall we pay school board members? $2k for members $3k for chair?
Mary Copans – I went to school meeting and was impressed. Like to amend this to increase it to match that of selectboard – $3k for members and $5k for chair. They are supervising as much money as the selectboard.
Alyssa – what’s the total?
Crispe – $6k total.
Slowinski – seems that assumption is that level of commitment is similar between two boards. David Schoales is on both…
Schoales – they are different. We do much with Act 46, but otherwise not as much. School staff does most of it. But do give the raise.
Bosworth – so this would increase the school budget? and wouldn’t go over our Act 46 limits?
Jill Stahl-Tyler – we can adjust legal fees line item, so wouldn’t increase budget. Don’t sue us, though.
Wheelock – would this eliminate need for school board to study reimbursement, discussed earlier?
Crispe – Finance Committee was going to look at it, and they could examine it whether this is adopted or not.
Amendment passes!
New salaries for school directors are approved!
….
Article 27 – Can the school district borrow in anticipation of taxes?
Kurt Daims – clarify why RTM rather than voters approve this?
Ron Stahely – for purpose of this, RTM are town voters.
Approved!
….
Article 28 – Can the school district get grants?
Approved!
Article 29 - School Board Budget
Article 29 – $15, 972,622 – education spending of about $15,292 per equalized pupil., 1.8% lower than current spending rates.
Jill Stahl-Tyler – many came to our meeting a few night ago. It’s an extraordinary year – we could put money into reserve and decrease taxes. It’s a blip and won’t happen again. Changed equalized pupil numbers – some get counted more than others. Much goes to pre schooling but they hadn’t been counted before. We maintained idea of rising lower kids up and keeping scores increasing. The gap is decreasing. Oak Grove and Academy had positive state reports to achieve gap decreases. Still decreasing in actual student numbers. Act 46 meetings – we’re down 1200 in the past year in the state. Everybody is down. Act 46 forums coming up, you are welcome to come to it or meetings.
Paula Melton – two questions – what proportion covers services and facilities by fed laws, and which can be modified if voters want to reduce those services?
Stahl-Tyler – there are some things mandated, and some things chosen. The things we’ve chosen are what we’re getting attention for progress. Helping lower kids rise – tutoring, summer school, kindergarten support, preschool coordination, food programs for all kids, healthy snacks programs, summer programs, professional development. They could be considered extras. Transportation could be cut for after school programs. But how do they get home?
Ron Stahley – some stats are instructive. We have school quality standards mandated by the state – staff to student ratio, etc. – but overall spending – 62% is on direct instruction, not admin or transportation. We’re above state averages. Admin cost are about 8%. We spend a bit more than state average, but have 61% poverty here, which is more. Student achievement is higher than state average for reading and science, but lower for math.
Frank Rucker – mandated costs – state doesn’t specify how we meet the goals. It’s hard to answer your question because the state allows this sort of forum to determine what to spend above the minimum. It’s why there is a range of spending per student in the state.
Stuart Copans – Impressed with schoollboard presentation. They are being modest. The difference between mandatory and optional isn’t so clear. If you give kids music lessons, their cortex grows. Exercise does the same thing. Things may look optional but are crucial and reason we’re saving money on mandated services.
Tara Sullivan – lower math rates. We took our advanced math son out of public schools. There are many kids who are wired for math – needs not being met and parents are taking them out of the district.
Don Webter – act 46 questions?
Crispe – no, not germane to budget.
K. Turnas – are the stats for this year?
Stahl-Tyler – these are compiled annually
K Turnas – will taxes go down?
Stahl-Tyler – taxes based on equalized students, and this year we got a bounce from preschoolers being counted.
Mike Corbeil – how much do we have to raise by taxes out of this budget…I see grants.. what about taxes.
Frank Rucker – the school funding formula is in the booklet. Developed by agency of education. Number you are asking for that depends on what is approved, then goes to state, then back to select board, factoring in the grand list. That’s the general concept. Revenues come in to offset…
Corbeil – how much by taxes – that’s all I want to know. Don’t care how you arrive at.
Rucker – we don’t calculate it. In 1996 we could answer it by taking full budget and divide by grand list. But now…the state is in the process. It’s not a number germane to every community. It’s a calculation unique to the budget, revenues available, and statewide property tax consideration.
Corbel – you can’t tell us…
Rucker – the legislature will set that when they adjourn. In June.
Corbel – i want to know how much our tax rate will be charged and how much will be raised. You can’t give me an answer. Where will the money be going?
Rucker – the $1.59 is the tax rate being proposed. It is an estimate. Will raise about about ha;f of the school budget. It raise about 7 0r 8 million. The money goes to taxpayer to town offices to the school.
Corbeil – why don’t we see it in revenue?
Rucker – state will give us about the same.
Corbeil – we should know the money before we vote. We shouldn’t be working from estimates.
Paula Melton – for those concerned with low income – this is tax dollars going to directly support those kids. It’s direct.
Hyam Siegel – was hoping Finance Committee would address school budget. School district budget analysis – they are okay with budget but want greater transparency from school board and more information about meetings. If they had trouble getting information, hard for others….
Crispe – dealing with the budget… a reminder.
Siegel – Finance Committee made these recommendations: support passage of budget, but offer rationale for specific dollar amounts in the budget. Not easy to do., but can you respond to the Finance Committee question about general fund balance and why you need this much?
Stahl-Tyler – Budget is all line item. what am I missing?
Franz Reichsman of Finance Committee – Melton knows the most about this. I think this relates to the idea of having a fund balance for reserve. We wondered why they allocated what they allocated to the fund balance. Select board has a policy. School board just put some in…
Schoales – we never established a 10% goal like the town for the schools. This year we a bond that retired, so for now we put that into the fund balance. Because of reduction in taxes and things going forward, we agreed that it would be prudent to put more into the reserve fund to take care of anticipated repairs. Next year the state starts out in a hole, so it makes sense to put some aside.
Siegel – could school board look at Finance Committee report recommendations?
Stahl-Tyler – we’ve already done a bunch of them. As fast as we can.
Steve Phillips – no longer paying 1996 bond?
Rucker – yes, winding up some bonds.
Phillips – so bonds do get paid off eventually. Per pupil costs are down, spending is up… aren’t there more pupils?
Stahl-Tyler – equalized pupils. Not real pupils.
Rucker – there will be about the same next year. Sate has shifted costs of preschool to the public schools.
Phillips – last question – the warning of article 29 – the commentary about the article is misplaced.
Stahl-Tyler – it is now required.
Phillips – last year was different.
Rucker – new law this year.
Tad Montgomery – Last year school districts bought solar net metering credits. Is the consortium being worked with to cover more of the school’s solar?
Rucker – yes. 500 kw already is more than what town consumes, so we had to find others to take some of it. The benefit to the school system is to reduce costs and net metering agreement got us a 10% discount. Schools consortium was independent of town initiative. Not useful for us as we were ahead.
Budget adopted!
Other business
Gartenstein – a resolution, thanking Donna Macomber for her service on selectboard. So thanked!
– Also thanks Crispe for standing all day. Applause.
Dennis Newman – move that town prohibited from user or membership fee at Senior Center.
Crispe – it’s advisory only
Newman – this started about 2 months ago. Currently there is a voluntary user fee, and a threat of a membership fee. This is essential a regressive tax on seniors. Rec & Parks may need fees for other services, but this is senior center only. User fees for bridge group? Writing group? Knitting group? One woman left knitting group over the knitting group fee. $50 a year – I can knit at home for that. The activities are helpful to seniors and others. That’s my proposal.
(Reps are walking out before meeting is over.)
Crisps: Vote is close, no’s appear to have it. It is defeated, but by very little.
Schoales – in education budget summary and budget expenditure detail in your packets. We want to see if you want the details. Do you?
(They do)
Don Webster – Act 46 committee. Summary?
Stahl-Tyler – a stew analogy – we’re making stew and mandated we can’t eat steaks. I wrote about it for a newspaper. We need to look at coming together. Clear that we will not be able to stay on our own. We have to merge.
Webster – thought there was an alternative.
Stahl-Tyler – very clear at end that only if state allows us, if we are equitable. State feels we are not equitable. Current leader of Ed would say no.
Webster – my analogy is we’re in a maze and missing some big picture items. When this Act is underway, we no longer have influence. Under circumstances, who will be vote on a budget in future?
Stahl-Tyler – strong opinions from all towns. Leadership councils would present budgets to towns, then budget votes could be done as BUHS both is done now (at a meeting), Australian ballot? Not sure, really. The unified district would vote. We’d cease the town school districts and have one large unified board.
Webster – RTM won’t vote on budget
Stahl-Tyler – all voters would have a say. Debate could occur at leadership councils, and unified board level. RTM could discuss specifics.
Webster – who would set tax rate for schools?
Rucker – calculated as it is now. Just shared among all towns in the union. Only unique aspect is grand list numbers of each town.
Webster – how about bond votes?
Rucker – everyone in the union
Stahl-Tyler – when I first came on the board, I thought of parents and students. Now on the board I think of all schools. A mentality shift. Inequities play out if all schools don’t teach same things.
Webster – high school district is different. All kids go to the same school. Regional decisions for multiple schools in other towns is different. What’s the commonality?
Stahl-Tyler – but we already have multiple schools in Brattleboro.
Webster – they are all in the same town.
Stahl-Tyler – there is dissension. We have realities to face. Declining enrollment – 23% in 12 years. That’s major. When do we make a shift? Do we do it or wait for the state to tell us how? Come to meetings! It’s like 5 stages of grief. Trying to find what’s best for all kids, and what makes sense for taxpayers.
Schoales- other options exist – smaller districts could merge. Equity problem – surrounding towns don’t have extended programs. The unified district would put us all in one pot, so when we add programs to surrounding schools or drop them here. Are Brattleboro taxpayers willing to pay for programs in surrounding towns. That’s the fiscal decision. In 5 years, rates need to be the same.
Stahl-Tyler – we disagree. Come to our forum. Exciting stuff. April 6th 6pm at Academy.
Mollie Burke – legislative report. We’ve put interesting things in the report. Please contact us. Also, come to the statehouse. We’ll show you around. Always fun to be a town meeting member.
MacKinnon – Motion to replace Columbus Day with Indigenous People day.
Daims – Friendly amendment that board be instructed to put it on the ballot.
Crispe – can’t be binding. Can just recommend.
Daims – can we request it?
Crispe – yes. Non-binding.
– is there a quorum?
(They count)(They do)
Vote on amendment – (they count) – it’s 28-43, so it fails.
Original motion to change Columbus Day to Indigenous People Day. (Not indigent.. ha!). It passes!
Crisps says the chair is tired.
Motion to adjourn. It passes.
4:15 end time.
Thank you!
As always, a great job in recording the annual RTM.